SOUTH-AFRICA-L Archives

Archiver > SOUTH-AFRICA > 2003-03 > 1046581608


From: "Tessa King" <>
Subject: [ZA] Stephen Brown
Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2003 07:06:48 +0200
References: <005301c2dde7$ea840660$6390a7cb@computer>


Hi Pat

Thank you so much for all the trouble you went to in typing up this info, it
is greatly appreciated. Since you offered, a GEDCOM would probably save you
much time in typing and save us constantly bugging you with questions.

Your help has been terrific....thanks so much.
Enjoy your day/night.
Tessa

----- Original Message -----
From: Doug & Pat Frykberg <>
To: <>
Sent: Thursday, February 27, 2003 12:37 AM
Subject: Re: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber & Brown & Hobbs




Tessa, Deborah and Sue.
OK here goes. Is this what you all want?
there is masses more and wouldn't you believe it, the 'history' I sent you
Sue, has been put into my newly reorganised filing system, and do you think
I can find the darned thing!!!! AARRGH*
And if you think there are too many Nathanials, Lydias, Stephens, Edwards
and Williams...... well tough! There are more!
All these dates are taken from the charming letters Mary Ann wrote to Lydia
Brown on her marriage to Alexander Menzies McGillewie in 1847 at Fort
Beaufort. (Tessa You mention Patrick McG. He was Alexander's cousin, a
famous hunter and with Selous at one time, and married Emily Loxton of
Whittlesea Give that bit later if you want it?)

Stephen BROWN b. 30 Jan. 1771 Harefield Mdx (son of Stephen John Wenman and
Susannah Brown unmarried)
Sarah HILLMAN b. 19 Jan. 1783, New Shoreham Sussex. She was Stephen's second
wife. m.4 March 1807 St Martins-in-the-Fields.
Stephen BROWN"S first wife was Mary Butler, m 22 April 1794 Hanwell Mdx who
seems to have lost several babies (all buried in Chelsea) but these survived
and are on Mary Anne's lists as her siblings)
1.Stephen b. 27 May 1796 Vauxhall Surrey . Died as a result of a horse fall
in Norwich. left a widow and 4 chn - not traced
2. Benjamin b 3 Feb 1800 Lambeth. m Mary Chorkeridd. Came to SA in 1826. d.
16 Sept 1828 Grahamstown 4 months after wife, leaving infant Lydia- (later
McGillewie) in the care of Mrs White and husband James (I have quite a lot
on them. He was Grahamstown undertaker. One of their daughters Mary married
Thomas Jenkins Missionary. In a letter from Buntingville she calls Lydia
(McG) 'sister')
3. Lydia BROWN b 20 Aug 1803. Chelsea. Was a maid servant but ended up
owning a boarding house and was quite well to do. But she and Mary Ann kept
up a long correspondence) died28 Oct 1892
Here follows the second family
Stephen's 4th and Sarah HILLMAN's 8 children:
4. Henry 1808-died in Peterbrough about 1812/13
5. Nathaniel b 17 Aug 1809 m Sarah Saunders. Had 19 ch. Most of them born in
distant mission stations (Mt Cole, Shawsbury, Glassbury, Buntingville,
Berlin)
6. Mary Ann b 14 Sept 1812 in Peterborough during her father's absence with
the 7th Hussars and Wellington's army.( I have had his military history
published by the Waterloo Assoc.) She is the Mary Ann who, married to Isaac
Wiggill wrote all the family birth dates signing herself MAW. Her 2nd
husband was John Kirk of whom I know nothing. Have their wedding cert
though. Third spouse John Halliday )
7. William b 20 Feb. 1812 Chelsea. Killed in a raid and buried at Bathurst
1843. Left a wife Harriet Biles and small child Edward. William is the only
child mentioned in the "Weymouth" lists. Nathaniel was in Algoa Bay before
the family (Morse Jones) and have never found Mary Ann's arrival)
8. George b 6 June 1817 d 27 Oct. 1819 Chelsea
9 Edward first SA born 29 Oct 1820 Green Fountain m Charity Hobbs
10 Harriett b 14 Dec. 1822 Green fountain. m George Ford
11.Thomas Hillman b 17 Sept 1824 Green Fountain. Became MLC married
Elizabeth Miles.
Best of luck. Let me know what else you would like. I can send a gedcom?
Pat
-----Original Message-----
From: Tessa King <>
To: <>
Date: Wednesday, 26 February 2003 04:10 PM
Subject: Re: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber & Brown & Hobbs


>Hi Pat
>
>Do you have birth dates for Stephen BROWN and Sarah HILLMAN and any of the
>children? My interest as well as Deborah's interest is from the Charity
>HOBBS perspective. Particularly interested in Mary Ann who married John
>KIRK. (I have just finished reading the "Memoirs of Grannie Kirk" for which
>I must again say a huge thank you!!).
>
>Who are the children of Patrick and Lydia McGillewie??
>
>Your info below has helped to fill out a bit more of their tree.
>
>Thank you and enjoy your day.
>Tessa King
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Doug & Pat Frykberg <>
>To: <>
>Sent: Monday, February 24, 2003 6:39 PM
>Subject: Re: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber
>
>
>Hi Deborah. Mine are descendents of Stephen Brown and Sarah Hillman. there
>are thousands of descendents and they are daily being unearthed and
recorded
>by Craig Brown of East London. He has no email but can give his address.
>Stephen & first wife Mary Butler had three kids, Stephen,Lydia (both stayed
>in England) and Benjamin who arrived 1826 and had one daughter Lydia who
>married Mcgillewie This is my line.
>Stephen and Sarah had another 8 Henry, Nathaniel (who m Sarah Saunders and
>had 19 ch!) Mary Ann (3 husbands no ch,)William, George, (all born in
>England) Edward b Bathurst married
>Charity Hobbs, Harriet (m Ford I think) Thomas Hillman Brown Legislative
>council.
>All of them had lotsa children!
>Are any yours?
>Pat
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Deborah <>
>To: <>
>Date: Monday, 24 February 2003 07:26 PM
>Subject: RE: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber
>
>
>>
>>Hi Pat,
>>WHich Browns? I am trying to get info on the BROWN Side as I have on
>>theHOBBS side.
>>Deborah.
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Doug & Pat Frykberg [mailto:]
>>Sent: 22 February, 2003 2:29 AM
>>To:
>>Subject: Re: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber
>>
>>
>>I'm not connected with any of those families (though the names are
>>familiar - Bowkers were on the Weymouth with my Browns)
>>But what a fascinating article, Craig. Thanks for posting it.
>>Pat
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Craig Hilton-Taylor <>
>>To: <>
>>Date: Friday, 21 February 2003 11:29 PM
>>Subject: Re: [ZA] Mary Elizabeth Bowker/Barber
>>
>>
>>>Hi All,
>>>
>>>Reading Ralph Anderson's comment about the birth of Anna Maria Bowker
>>>on the 'Weymouth' reminded me about an article I found in Wednesday's
>>>issue of The Times newspaper in the UK, which may be of interest to
>>>other Bowker/Barber researchers.
>>>
>>>Skimming through a supplement to The Times, my eye caught sight of an
>>>article on Charles Darwin and being a biologist I was immediately
>>>interested. Reading the article, the Bowker name jumped out at me,
>>>because my wife's family has links to the Bowker's.
>>>
>>>Cambridge University has a large research project to work through more
>>>than 145,000 letters written to or by Charles Darwin. Much of this
>>>correspondence was concerning attempts by Darwin to find evidence to
>>>support his various theories. One of the areas currently being
>>>researched is the correspondence that relates to Darwin's book
>>>'Expression of the Emotions in Man and Animals' which was published in
>>>1872. The article says that "typical of the response is a letter from
>>>Mary Elizabeth Bowker Barber, a keen naturalist, who ran a farm in South
>>>Africa and spent time diamond prospecting in Kenya. She wrote that
>>>members of local tribes showed astonishment by looking serious and
>>>placing their right hand on the mouth and uttering a word meaning
>>>'wonderful'."
>>>
>>>At the end of the article it says that "a calendar listing all the
>>>letters in the collection is avalable on the project's website, and the
>>>long-term aim is to make the transcripts of all the correspondence
>>>accessible online at http://www.lib.cam.ac.uk/Departments/Darwin/ "
>>>(note the spelling in this link is case-sensitive). I see from the
>>>database that there is also correspondence from James Henry Bowker, a
>>>brother of Mary Elizabeth.
>>>
>>>Mary Elizabeth was certainly a remarkable natural historian who made
>>>many notable discoveries and contributions to science. But I did not
>>>know that she had gone diamond prospecting in Kenya. I knew from other
>>>sources that she had spent time in Kimberley during the diamond rush
>>>period, so Kenya is presumably a mistake. There is incidentally, also a
>>>recent biographical account of Mary Elizabeth in the South African
>>>Succulent Society's magazine called Aloe (vol. 38 parts 3&4, pages 52-55
>>>(2001). The biography article was written by Tony Dold, a descendent of
>>>the Dold 1820 Settler Family, and it mentions a number of other
>>>references which may be of interest to some.
>>>
>>>Best wishes
>>>
>>>Craig Hilton-Taylor
>>>(ex Cape Town, now Cambridge, UK)
>>>
>>>
>>>---------------------------------------------------------------
>>>This E-mail and any attachments are private, intended solely for
>>>the use of the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient,
>>>they have been sent to you in error: any use of information in
>>>them is strictly prohibited.
>>>
>>>The employer reserves the right to monitor the content of
>>>the message and any reply received.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
>>>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>Try Cyndi's List for all the genealogical links you will ever need:
>>>http://www.CyndisList.com/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
>>************************************************************
>>Please send your replies to the list so that others can also
>>participate in the discussion.
>>
>>
>>==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
>>******************************************
>>Please don't send attachments to the list.
>>
>
>
>
>==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
>****************************************************
>This list is for the discussion of genealogy and any
>related subject, as it applies to South and Southern
>Africa. Please do participate.
>
>
>
>
>==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
>If you want to unsubscribe send an email with the word unsubscribe
>in the body, to the correct address, dependant on how you are subscribed
>if in mail mode:
>
>if in digest mode:
>
>



==== SOUTH-AFRICA Mailing List ====
*****************************************************************
If you need a translation from Afrikaans into English please visit my
website at http://home.global.co.za/~mercon/words.html for a list of
volunteers who
are prepared to do translations for you.


This thread: