QUAKER-ROOTS-L Archives

From: "Howard Swain" <>
Subject: [Q-R] Re: Gayer line
Date: Sun, 2 Jun 2002 16:28:35 -0700
References: <5.1.0.14.2.20020529122336.031e0490@mail.earthlink.net> <5.1.0.14.2.20020601105223.02f138a0@mail.earthlink.net>

Hi K, Leslie, and all,

From: "K. McGee" <>
Sent: Saturday, June 01, 2002 11:03 AM

> Hi Howard,
> Yes, I've discussed that with a few, and then I found this and another bit
> which I am requesting from NHA:
>
> >Collection: 156 - Gayer Family Papers, 1709-1712
> >LOCATION: FOLDER 1
> >CONTENTS: Elizabeth (Gayer)Gayer. daughter of Sir John, wife of William
> >Gayer, Jr.
> >ALS to Brother and sister [Jethro and Dorcas(Gayer)], regarding her
> >inheritance. London, England, Jan. 5, 1712
> >Sir John Gayer of England ( -1649)
> >Copy of will, October 5, 1710.

Sir John's will as well as that of William, Sr., and William, Jr. and also
letters from Jane, the mother of William and Sir John, and other family
members are transcirbed in "The Gayer Family" by William C. Folger
in NEHGR vol 31 (July 1877) pp 297 to 302.

I wonder what the evidence is that the Elizabeth who married William, Jr.,
was the dau. of Sir John as you show above.
Sir John does not mention any children of his in his will of Oct 1710.
He does mention a niece, Elizabeth Gayer, who is unmarried at that time.
I presume she is the dau. of another brother, name unknown.

William, Jr.'s will of 9 Nov 1712 mentions a wife, Elizabeth; but does
not (as far as I can see) give any info on her parents.
Thanks, Leslie, for the copy of her letter.

Mr. Folger in a section on the children of Wm. Sr. says that Wm. Jr.
married his cousin Elizabeth. But I see no evidence that he married
his cousin. Folger also says he has not found the name of her father.

It is possible that Wm., Jr., married his cousin Elizabeth (the neice
of Sir John) and dau. of his uncle ______ . But I have not seen the
evidence.


Now, as to the disproven royal ancestry --
What apparently led people astray (and is discussed in the Davies
article) is a chart titled "Gayer of Trenbrace" in The Visitations of
the County of Cornwall, by J. L. Vivian, 1887; p. 172.

This chart shows "Sir John Gayer, Governor of Bombay 1694" as a
son of Humphry Gayer of Plymouth. This Humphry is shown as a
brother of another Sir John who was Lord Mayor of London in 1647.
However, people apparently failed to heed the fine print at the bottom
of the chart. This says that the portion in italics is from the Visitation
of Cornwall in 1573, Harleian Ms.1079. And "The portion in ordinary type
is taken from a family pedigree privately printed by Arthur Edward Gayer,
Esq., Q.C., LL.D., A.D. 1870, with a few additions"

Needless to say, the part about Sir John of Bombay (as well as Humphry)
is in ordinary type. So, even though it appears in a "Visitation" book
the crucial information was _not_ obtained during a visitation by the
King's herald.

Furthermore, the chart shows Sir John of Bombay as having sisters
Elizabeth Calmady and Mary Piper. While in reality Sir John had sisters
Elizabeth Matthews, Joan Hooper, and Jane Lee as well as a
brother, William, as shown in his will.


> Howard, I'm also interested to know if you've researched the Swain name in
> the Rockingham County area of NC? I have a connection, not necessarily
> Quaker, to the surname within my Smith group of that area and need some help.

Sorry, my Swains stayed on Nantucket till about 1850 when they moved
to the midwest. Don't know anything about the NC branch, except some
(many?, most?) of them did descend from the Nantucket Swains.

Regards,
Howard

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• [Q-R] Re: Gayer line by "Howard Swain" <>