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From: "Peter E. Murray" <>
Subject: Spanish Visigoths - Is this line for real?
Date: Mon, 2 Dec 1996 00:20:13 -0500


John de Celis (Gen-Medieval Newsgroup 17 Nov 1996 gives the
following relationships:

Clodoveo, 1st Christian K of Franks, father of:
Clothild (his dau) married Amalarico, parents of:
Leovigildo (their son), king of West Goths.

My comment here is that the marriage of Clovis' dau Clothild to
Amalaric king of the Visigoths, appears in Gregory of Tours and
presumably other sources as well. But neither that source nor any
other that I have seen mention any issue of the marriage.
Wolfram's book "The Goths" p480 n.605/6 cites Claude and agrees
with him in assuming that Amalaric was born c502. Amalaric married
after 526 to the daughter of Clovis (cites Zollner, "Franken" and
directs the reader also to Jordanes "Getica" and Martindale's
"Prosopography"). Then on p481 n.621 he cites Claude in saying
"After the death of Amalaric there existed in 531 'no legitimate
member of the family of Theodoric I (recte Theodorid)' ". As for
Leovigild (and his brother and predecessor Athanagild), there is no
indication of their parentage, other than indications in Gregory of
Tours that Frankish kings Sigibert's and Chilperic's marriages to
Brunhild and Galswinth respectively were considered very
prestigious matches for the Frankish kings, suggesting that the
Ancestry of Athanagild and Leovigild was noteworthy (and presumably
kingly). If Amalaric did have children, they would have been very
young when he died.

Brian Thomsett's Royal Genealogy Page has a section on the
Visigoths in Spain from which the following information is
extracted:

Leodegild, K Visigoths 568-586
by m to Theodosia, was father of:

Reccared I, K Visigoths 586-601
by m to Chodoswintha of Austrasia, was father of:

Swinthila, K Visigoths 621-631 d633
by m to Theodora, was father of:

Chindaswind, K Visigoths 642-653
by m to Rekiberga, was father of:

Favila
by unknown m was father of:

Pelayo, K Visigoths
by m. to Gaudiosa, was father of:

Hermesinda (dtr)
m. Alfonso I, K Asturias

Todd Farmerie, citing a reinterpretation of original sources by
Szabolca de Vajay, gave the following revised descent from
Alfonso I, K Asturias 739 d757, (son of Pedro) m. Irmesinda (dau of
Pelayo),
parents of:

Fruela I, K Asturias 757 d769
by m. to Munia (dau of his uncle Fruela son of Pedro), father of:

Fruela (brother of Alfonso II) fl 798, father of:

Vermudo I, K Asturias, father of:

Ramiro I, K Asturias 842 d850

The above information taken together suggests a descent of the
later kings of Asturias traceable through the Spanish Visigothic
kings to the earlier Visigoths, and in the female line to the
Ostrogoths. The trouble is that it is unlikely to be correct.
While there are good reasons to accept the reinterpreted descent
from Pelayo and his son-in-law Alfonso I, there appears to be no
support for the parentage of Fafila, father of Pelayo (if I
understand recent comments by Todd Farmerie, Gen-Medieval
newsgroup). I was surprised to see a connected line from
Chindaswind back to Leovigild complete with marriages and their
issue and wonder if all this is well documented. Finally, the
claim that Leovigild was son of Amalaric and his wife Clothild
looks very much like wishful thinking. The standard view is that
Amalaric and his brother Gesalec were the last of the Balth dynasty
of Visigoths (see Wolfram "The Goths", citing Claude).

So which connections are supported, probable or neither in the
above lines?

Peter

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